Dispute over flag protest erupts in Wisc. village

[Edmaster]

By ROBERT IMRIE, Associated Press Writer Robert Imrie, Associated Press Writer – Fri Jul 10, 2:44 pm ET

WAUSAU, Wis. – An American flag flown upside down as a protest in a northern Wisconsin village was seized by police before a Fourth of July parade and the businessman who flew it — an Iraq war veteran — claims the officers trespassed and stole his property.

A day after the parade, police returned the flag and the man's protest — over a liquor license — continued.

The American Civil Liberties Union of Wisconsin is considering legal action against the village of Crivitz for violating Vito Congine Jr.'s' First Amendment rights, Executive Director Chris Ahmuty said.

"It is not often that you see something this blatant," Ahmuty said.

In mid-June, Congine, 46, began flying the flag upside down — an accepted way to signal distress — outside the restaurant he wants to open in Crivitz, a village of about 1,000 people some 65 miles north of Green Bay.

He said his distress is likely bankruptcy because the village board refused to grant him a liquor license after he spent nearly $200,000 to buy and remodel a downtown building for an Italian supper club.

Congine's upside-down-flag represents distress to him; to others in town, it represents disrespect of the flag.

Hours before a Fourth of July parade, four police officers went to Congine's property and removed the flag under the advice of Marinette County District Attorney Allen Brey.

Neighbor Steven Klein watched in disbelief.

"I said, 'What are you doing?' Klein said. "They said, 'It is none of your business.'"

The next day, police returned the flag.

Brey declined comment Friday.

Marinette County Sheriff Jim Kanikula said it was not illegal to fly the flag upside down but people were upset and it was the Fourth of July.

"It is illegal to cause a disruption," he said.

The parade went on without any problems, Kanikula said.

Village President John Deschane, 60, an Army veteran who served in Vietnam, said many people in town believe it's disrespectful to fly the flag upside down.

"If he wants to protest, let him protest but find a different way to do it," Deschane said.

Congine, a Marine veteran who served in Iraq in 2004, said he intends to keep flying the flag upside down.

"It is pretty bad when I go and fight a tyrannical government somewhere else," Congine said, "and then I come home to find it right here at my front door."


Source: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090710/ap_on_re_us/us_upside_down_flag

This certainly is nowhere near the level of burning the US flag in protest, but I figured this shares enough similarities to be worthy of discussion, particularly because of the manner in which the sheriff's department acted.

I'm torn on this one.

I do not approve of needless bashing of the American flag, but our First Amendment allows for freedom of speech and peaceful protest. Was his reasons for flying the flag upside-down warranted? I don't think I'm one to judge that.

I also do not approve of the manner in which the man's flag was removed. Trespassing and stealing private property is NOT how supposed "law enforcement officers" are supposed to behave, regardless of it being the Fourth of July. This hardly constitutes a "disruption," as the sheriff claims.

Your thoughts?

[Shady]

"It is illegal to cause a disruption," he said.

That's bullshit.

Who is held responsible if the law reacts unlawfully to a lawful situation?

[Edmaster]

That's bullshit.

Who is held responsible if the law reacts unlawfully to a lawful situation?

Much to our dismay, the law, rather than the one responsible.

Because god forbid an LEO does something unlawful, because that's just not possible. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B8U1JRAJpr8) :rolleyes:

[Tonus]

I do not approve of needless bashing of the American flag, but our First Amendment allows for freedom of speech and peaceful protest. Was his reasons for flying the flag upside-down warranted? I don't think I'm one to judge that.
It doesn't seem as if he was trying to bash the American flag. His use of the upside-down flag to display his 'distress' seems a bit overboard considering the circumstances, but it appears that his point is "I'm being railroaded" instead of "death to the USA."

[Diniden]

I dunno, if it's an accepted way of signaling distress then isn't that kind of like the same thing as running in a crowd or theater and yelling fire? Or calling 911 with no real emergency to report? In war time, abusing that distress signal could wind up getting an entire group killed.

I see it as something that shouldn't be abused in any way and should be treated the same way the other situations I mentioned are handled.

As far as disrespect, if it's a distress signal then obviously it's not disrespect. Its just abusing an emergency help system. As for it being a protest, the guy needs to learn how to write real big and spend 25 cents on a poster board. Trying to be unique with your ideas should have their limits.

And whether he's in distress or not is apparently his own fault for not planning these things out ahead or being prepared for potential failure. That's the life of an entrepreneur and of one who lives amongst capitalism.

[Grunthos]

I dunno, if it's an accepted way of signaling distress then isn't that kind of like the same thing as running in a crowd or theater and yelling fire? Or calling 911 with no real emergency to report? In war time, abusing that distress signal could wind up getting an entire group killed.

I see it as something that shouldn't be abused in any way and should be treated the same way the other situations I mentioned are handled.

As far as disrespect, if it's a distress signal then obviously it's not disrespect. Its just abusing an emergency help system. As for it being a protest, the guy needs to learn how to write real big and spend 25 cents on a poster board. Trying to be unique with your ideas should have their limits.

And whether he's in distress or not is apparently his own fault for not planning these things out ahead or being prepared for potential failure. That's the life of an entrepreneur and of one who lives amongst capitalism.

Pretty much my thoughts, too.

Not illegal, but rather sophomoric, and way over the top. "crying wolf," rather than shouting fire in a theater - - nobody's likely to come to harm through his actions.

I wouldn't agree with police acting aginst this, but I would probably myself go in and talk to the man, reminding him that he is disrespecting the purpose of the symbol, in his attempt to make a point. His LIFE is not in IMMEDIATE danger, therefore issuing a m'aidez is serious over-reaction.

If he decides that he's so upset that he doesn't care, then I would decide that his opinion is not worth very much, but he's free to express it.

His being a veteran, frankly, is pretty much a non sequitur in this case. Prior military service doesn't give someone greater or lesser right to speak out... but it should have made him less willing to "go there." And as much as we veterans may like to think so, it doesn't atomatically confer common sense.

The reporter, as is usual these days where the emotional hook of the story is so much more important than actually uncovering the facts, left us without some important information:

1) Why was this man denied a liquor license for this restaurant? Normally, a city is thrilled to have a restaurant open, so there's more to this story. Zoning issue? Past bad history of the owner with regard to alcohol sales? Local ordinance regarding liquor establishments? We have no clue, and therefore no way to judge if this man's protest was in fact appropriate, or belligerant.

2) What kind of idiot spends 200K to prep a restaurant BEFORE getting their licenses in order?

[Edmaster]

Even without a liquor license, he should still be able to open the restaurant as a BYOB, so spending the 200k might not have been SO bad. True, he's losing potential revenue without the liquor license, but that's the risks of the business.

I'm also curious if there are other factors at play here. Probably.

[Grunthos]

With Paul Harvey gone, we'll never know.

[Tonus]

2) What kind of idiot spends 200K to prep a restaurant BEFORE getting their licenses in order?
That was the first thing that came to mind when I read the article. In most places, a liquor license is critical to the success of a restaurant. If you're spending that much on a site, it would behoove you to find out if there will be any problems securing one.